Thank you! It’s altogether too easy to glamorise these awful people. We see it in the media all the time. Yet there is nothing good to be said about them. They are just losers in every way.
And that *you* for your comment, Jeffrey! The Hierarchy of Needs is a brilliant descriptive tool, I agree. It sometimes gives me a means of telling people why, after an hour in a museum, I just can't take in any more culture. My feet hurt! Perhaps, as some psychologists have said, it functions better as a description than a prediction, but there's room for that in science, after all.
"His motive was as non-existent as his conscience. He didn’t have a reason to do it: he just did it."
I do wonder if there really is such a thing as a human action without a motive. Of course, sometimes people cannot explain, understand, or properly express their morives, or they don't want to. But strangling somebody to death is a decision, and it means some effort and risk of punishment. I am looking forward to hear your opinion.
Thank you very much for your interesting & thoughtful comment! I’m sure I was guilty of a rhetorical flourish there. It would perhaps be closer to the truth to say that he had nothing that we would usually recognise as a motive: he wasn’t after revenge or material gain or anything. For sure, a person can be unaware of what drives them to do certain things. In fact, I’d be tempted to say that is more the rule than otherwise. Whether that’s quite what we usually mean when we use the word ‘motive’, I’m not sure. A good question for class I reckon!
Thank you very much for your response. It makes me think about how complicated the very common concept of "motive" actually is. Is money the motive for a robbery, or is money only an objective in order to achieve other goals (higher status, e.g.)? Is sex the motive for sexual assault, or is it just another way to show aggression, to humiliate the victim, to feel powerful and in control?
What exactly were Raskolnikovs motives to commit a murder in Dostojevskis famous novel?
This is a terrific question, so thank you for that. You are quite right that the concept of a’motive’ is a very loose one. It does a job, legalistically speaking, but as far asPsychology is concerned we could use something a little more precise. To your excellent questions I’d add this one - can you have a motive without knowing you do? A psychologist would be likely to say yes, but that kind of idea never sits well with legal professionals. The two professions can be somewhat at odds over issues like this. Thank you, too, for mentioning Raskolnikov. It’s as if you read my mind! Don’t miss Wednesday’s newsletter, which is called ‘How You Became Raskolnikov’.
Well, that is indeed a very good question. Can a motive be pre-/sub-/un-conscious? To answer that it would be neccessary to distinguish between concepts that get too often confused with each other: Causes, motives, needs, and emotions. Hate, for example, is an emotion. The idea to punish the person I hate, on the other hand, might be called a motive. I would argue that people very often do not exactly know WHY they want to take a certain action (they do not understand the underlying mental states). But they very well know THAT they want to take a certain action.
A motive does not necessarily have to be very elaborated or aiming a distant future goal, does it? Maybe it is enough to know that you want to take a certain action in that very moment to call it a motive. This was just a quick, half thought-through response, but I hope that I managed to get my point across adequately
Some really good points made there. My apologies for taking so long to get back to you. I fear there have been a lot of lectures recently! You are absolutely right to ask whether a motive can be unconscious (or any or all of the other versions of the word!) I suspect what we are circling here is the distinction between motive and motivation. The former is what the legal system is after: the latter is all psychologists have to offer! The two are rarely symmetrical. I think it's quite right to say that one's motivation can be unconscious - indeed, it's likely that it often is. Perhaps it usually is. Barristers and judges don't want details about that though. Neither do juries. They want stories, or narratives, the more straightforward the better. This is why we sometimes get debates, of course, over the usefulness of 'expert witnesses. No one wants the courtroom to become a psychology lecture-theatre, and I think I include most psychologists in that!
Thanks for your comments on Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs. I have found it to be a great tool to easily explain to others, (and myself), what's going on in my life. Or where I am as I journey through life.
"Too lazy or talentless to deserve the attention, they’d taken the worst shortcut imaginable."
I love this line and it speaks so much about these types of killers.
Thank you! It’s altogether too easy to glamorise these awful people. We see it in the media all the time. Yet there is nothing good to be said about them. They are just losers in every way.
And that *you* for your comment, Jeffrey! The Hierarchy of Needs is a brilliant descriptive tool, I agree. It sometimes gives me a means of telling people why, after an hour in a museum, I just can't take in any more culture. My feet hurt! Perhaps, as some psychologists have said, it functions better as a description than a prediction, but there's room for that in science, after all.
"His motive was as non-existent as his conscience. He didn’t have a reason to do it: he just did it."
I do wonder if there really is such a thing as a human action without a motive. Of course, sometimes people cannot explain, understand, or properly express their morives, or they don't want to. But strangling somebody to death is a decision, and it means some effort and risk of punishment. I am looking forward to hear your opinion.
Thank you very much for your interesting & thoughtful comment! I’m sure I was guilty of a rhetorical flourish there. It would perhaps be closer to the truth to say that he had nothing that we would usually recognise as a motive: he wasn’t after revenge or material gain or anything. For sure, a person can be unaware of what drives them to do certain things. In fact, I’d be tempted to say that is more the rule than otherwise. Whether that’s quite what we usually mean when we use the word ‘motive’, I’m not sure. A good question for class I reckon!
Thank you very much for your response. It makes me think about how complicated the very common concept of "motive" actually is. Is money the motive for a robbery, or is money only an objective in order to achieve other goals (higher status, e.g.)? Is sex the motive for sexual assault, or is it just another way to show aggression, to humiliate the victim, to feel powerful and in control?
What exactly were Raskolnikovs motives to commit a murder in Dostojevskis famous novel?
This is a terrific question, so thank you for that. You are quite right that the concept of a’motive’ is a very loose one. It does a job, legalistically speaking, but as far asPsychology is concerned we could use something a little more precise. To your excellent questions I’d add this one - can you have a motive without knowing you do? A psychologist would be likely to say yes, but that kind of idea never sits well with legal professionals. The two professions can be somewhat at odds over issues like this. Thank you, too, for mentioning Raskolnikov. It’s as if you read my mind! Don’t miss Wednesday’s newsletter, which is called ‘How You Became Raskolnikov’.
Well, that is indeed a very good question. Can a motive be pre-/sub-/un-conscious? To answer that it would be neccessary to distinguish between concepts that get too often confused with each other: Causes, motives, needs, and emotions. Hate, for example, is an emotion. The idea to punish the person I hate, on the other hand, might be called a motive. I would argue that people very often do not exactly know WHY they want to take a certain action (they do not understand the underlying mental states). But they very well know THAT they want to take a certain action.
A motive does not necessarily have to be very elaborated or aiming a distant future goal, does it? Maybe it is enough to know that you want to take a certain action in that very moment to call it a motive. This was just a quick, half thought-through response, but I hope that I managed to get my point across adequately
Some really good points made there. My apologies for taking so long to get back to you. I fear there have been a lot of lectures recently! You are absolutely right to ask whether a motive can be unconscious (or any or all of the other versions of the word!) I suspect what we are circling here is the distinction between motive and motivation. The former is what the legal system is after: the latter is all psychologists have to offer! The two are rarely symmetrical. I think it's quite right to say that one's motivation can be unconscious - indeed, it's likely that it often is. Perhaps it usually is. Barristers and judges don't want details about that though. Neither do juries. They want stories, or narratives, the more straightforward the better. This is why we sometimes get debates, of course, over the usefulness of 'expert witnesses. No one wants the courtroom to become a psychology lecture-theatre, and I think I include most psychologists in that!
Thanks for your comments on Maslow's Hierarchy of Needs. I have found it to be a great tool to easily explain to others, (and myself), what's going on in my life. Or where I am as I journey through life.